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Two more questions (Camouflage, Rock to Mud)

 
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Guizo
dragonfoal



Joined: 03 Sep 2014
Posts: 5
Location: Porto Alegre, RS

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 5:02 am GMT    Post subject: Two more questions (Camouflage, Rock to Mud) Reply with quote

Hi again,

So, yesterday my friends and I played another Dragon Dice™ match which was probably the best so far with some new units (namely Ferals and Treefolk). Two new questions cropped up. Here are they, with a short scenario description:

1) I had a quite large Treefolk army on a terrain turned to a melee face. Three of my 3-health units were under the effect of a camouflage spell. One of my friends decided to attack this army with a missile attack from an adjacent terrain. Question: if he inflicts me 12 points of damage and I roll three saves, can I assign 9 points of "harmless" damage (because the spells would change 9 into zero) to the three camouflaged units and kill no one? We were a bit confused because Camouflage says the units are immune to damage inflicted by non-melee effects, but it doesn't say they cannot be the target of damage inflicted by non-melee effects, which is quite different.

2) One of my friends was defending an 8th face swampland with a mixed Goblin/Coral Elves army. Thanks to the combined effect of the 8th face and the Goblins' racial ability, his Goblins could quadruple manoeuvres. Though I didn't do it, for a time I considered casting both a Transmute Rock to Mud and a Flash Flood on the same turn, in this order, to try and move the terrain back to its 7th face. Question: had I done that, who would choose which six manoeuvre results should be subtracted from which units? Since the subtracting is done before the multiplying, this would could mean a huge difference in the same roll of dice, since remaining Goblin manoeuvres would be quadrupled (racial ability + 8th face), but remaining Coral Elves manoeuvres would be only doubled (8th face only). Our fictional scenario went somewhat like:

- I cast Transmute Rock to Mud and then Flash Flood on his 8th-face Swampland
- He rolls 6 Goblin and 3 Coral Elves manoeuvres while trying to resist Flash Flood
- If I am the one to decide where to subtract, I subtract six from the Goblins and he gets a total of 3 Coral Elves Manoeuvres x 2 (8th face) = 6, therefore losing to Flash Flood
- If he is the one to decide where to subtract, he subtracts 3 from the Goblins and 3 from the Coral Elves, getting a total of 3 Goblin manoeuvres x 2 (8th face) x 2 (racial ability) = 12, therefore resisting Flash Flood.

Other than that, this time we did take a more than cursory glance at the spells list and the game actually played out quite differently. Thanks for your tips! Smile

Best regards,
Guilherme.
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chuckpint
White Dragon
SFR President
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Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 9002
Location: Evanston, IL

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 6:52 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hide, Camouflage, and Fade are all similar in a few ways. They protect units from certain damage. However, they do not protect the armies they are in. So your army had to take some damage. That means that the units that were Camouflaged could not be the ones that take that damage. Other units in the army had to take the damage. Here's an example. You a have an army with 10 health of units. 2 common units have Camouflage. After rolling for saves, that army has to take 10 points of missile damage. So the other 8 health in the army would be killed, the 2 health that are Camouflaged would not be killed. Now let's change that so it was on 2 points of missile damage. You can not kill the Camouflaged units, so 2 other health of units would have to be killed, leaving you with 8 health, 2 health (those 2 commons) that are Camouflaged.

Penalties that are generic (i.e. effect an army without a specific target otherwise) are always applied as the army owner desires. So in your case, the army owner gets to pick which units are effected by the Transmute Rock to Mud (TRtM). Since he would not want the terrain turned off 8, he would apply it to the Coral Elves and 3 of the 6 Goblin maneuvers. That would leave 3 Goblin maneuvers, which would then become 12 maneuvers, more than enough to stop the Flash Flood. TRtM, Palsy, and other subtraction spells that effect an army, are all applied by the army owner.
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You can never have too many dice.
First Place at the first ever Daemon Dice™ sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Dice™, 20,000 Daemon Dice™, and others (too many to count).
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