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New Product for Gencon2010
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cliffwiggs
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 9:55 am GMT    Post subject: New Product for Gencon2010 Reply with quote

This is just a teaser for now, but more information will be coming as it is finalized for release. At this point any detail is subject to change....

In 2008, the last of the 'Magestorm!' expansions were sold, meaning that new players would be unable to obtain these game components. The decision was made to break this large expansion up into more accessible pieces.

So in 2009, the first portion of that expansion (Dragonkin and Dragonkin Champions) was re-released in a new format. This contained all your Dragonkin needs as well as including the SFR Red/Blue Dragonkin Champions.

In 2010, the next portion of that expansion will be released (Minor Terrains). As well as making these flexible terrains available, this was an excellent time to increase the strategic flexibility of the game as well. Thus we introduce the 'Battlefields' expansion.

"Configuration of terrain is an aid to the army." Sun-Tzu, The Art of War.



The text on the back reads:
Quote:

With Battlefields, the Dragon Diceā„¢ general now has more options for shaping his battlefield. This expansion includes new basic terrains, the Feylands (Fire and Water) and the Wastelands (Fire and Air). New special frontier terrains - the Dragon Lair, Grove, Castle, and Vortex - add a new layer of strategy to your battlefield choices at the start of a game. You can also alter the battlefield during play with the use of minor terrains, lesser objectives that may give your army a needed boost if you're willing to take a risk.

Box contains 7 terrain dice, 1 Feylands terrain (Red/Green) in a random mix of 8 types, 1 Wasteland terrain (Red/Blue) in a random mix of 8 types, 2 special terrains in a random mix of Blue/Green, Blue/Golf, Gold/Red, Gold/Green in 4 types, and 3 minor terrains in random mix of all 6 color combos and 4 types.

Use of this expansion requires the Dragon Diceā„¢ Starter Set and Dragon Diceā„¢ Standard Rules. The rules for these dice and the complete Standard Rules are available from SFR, Inc. at www.sfr-inc.com


Additional details will be released at a later date.
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dproman
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 10:54 am GMT    Post subject: New Product for GenCon 2010 Reply with quote

Hey Guys,

Looks Great! Very Happy Can't wait!
Would I be able to get an empty box for display at my upcoming Demos? or should I just print out a copy of the picture?

Product sounds awesome!, keep 'em coming ! Laughing

Thanks,
Dave
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chuckpint
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 11:26 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boxes have not yet been printed.

If you want to print out the box in a decent resolution, download this file:
http://home.chuckpint.com/SFR/Battlefields_11.pdf Warning 25meg!
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dutchjohn
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:53 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm a nice product offcourse but a poopy brown box is not the way to sell I guess. check some of your store owner contacts to see if they like the design. Cause I think the box is relatively ugly.

but I'll buy them I don't want to miss a beat.
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Drachenwurfel
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:54 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is so great, i am waiting now 15 years for the new terrain!
Will you post previews from the new dice sidelayouts and eight side?
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riolis
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 7:31 pm GMT    Post subject: YES!! Reply with quote

New Terrains to look forward to storming with mass armies Twisted Evil can't wait Cool
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chuckpint
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 9:46 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not so fast guys. This is as much "teaser" as you are going to get for awhile. Maybe in a month or so, we'll post some more....

But only if you are good boys and girls. Mr. Green
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DEEPBLUEB2
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:33 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
hmm a nice product offcourse but a poopy brown box is not the way to sell I guess. check some of your store owner contacts to see if they like the design. Cause I think the box is relatively ugly.

but I'll buy them I don't want to miss a beat.


The color scheme was based on the original Magestorm! Box.
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Drachenwurfel
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:41 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

i like it
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shoesan
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 4:29 pm GMT    Post subject: Re: New Product for Gencon2010 Reply with quote

cliffwiggs wrote:

With Battlefields, the Dragon Diceā„¢™ general now has more options for shaping his battlefield. This expansion includes new basic terrains, the Feylands (Fire and Water) and the Wastelands (Fire and Air). New special frontier terrains - the Dragon Lair, Grove, Castle, and Vortex - add a new layer of strategy to your battlefield choices at the start of a game. You can also alter the battlefield during play with the use of minor terrains, lesser objectives that may give your army a needed boost if you're willing to take a risk.

Box contains 7 terrain dice, 1 Feylands terrain (Red/Green) in a random mix of 8 types, 1 Wasteland terrain (Red/Blue) in a random mix of 8 types, 2 special terrains in a random mix of Blue/Green, Blue/Golf, Gold/Red, Gold/Green in 4 types, and 3 minor terrains in random mix of all 6 color combos and 4 types.

Use of this expansion requires the Dragon Diceā„¢™ Starter Set and Dragon Diceā„¢™ Standard Rules. The rules for these dice and the complete Standard Rules are available from SFR, Inc. at www.sfr-inc.com



I take it that "frontier terrains" in the first paragraph and "special terrains" in the second paragraph are the same thing, right?

This means that with the release of this kicker, there will be 8 major terrains available in 6 color combinations (48 different dice) in the Dragon Diceā„¢ game (only 32 of these will be available from this kicker). It appears that the 4 new terrains can only be used as frontier choices. Then, there will also be minor terrains available in the same new color combinations, as well as a "reprinting" of the original minor terrains... there will be a total of 24 minor terrains available in Dragon Diceā„¢, and all of them are possible pulls in the new packs. Is this correct?

And to go one step further, 8 packs of the new kicker could conceivably yield at least one of each new die and color combo, provided your pulls worked out perfectly.

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chuckpint
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 5:18 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

The original 16 terrains will only be available in starters. Some day, we hope to put the Feylands and Wastelands into a starter. But for now, this is the only way to get those. Since those two terrains match exactly Scalders and Firewalkers, and those two races will most likely never be in a starter, I'm not going to say it would be a sure thing to put them in starters.

Just think of this new expansion this way: it brings out new terrains, and at the same time brings back into production the minor terrains.
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First Place at the first ever Daemon Diceā„¢ sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Diceā„¢, 20,000 Daemon Diceā„¢, and others (too many to count).
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karoath
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:27 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

This looks like a great addition to the game and I am very excited to see the rules for these dice. Is this the exact box art that will be used for production? I don't want to offend the artist, but the 3D graphics look amateurish. In my opinion, the art itself could lead to some trouble with sales. Art can directly reflect a person's view of the product... poor quality art can lead people to believe that the product is also poor quality. It impacts a person's view of the company as well.

You may want to try Terragen (http://www.planetside.co.uk/terragen/productmain.shtml) for the terrain images since it can produce very professional results. Details (such as the castle) can be superimposed or the model can be imported into another program, such as Blender 3D (http://www.blender.org/). Both of these products can produce very nice results.[/url]
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DEEPBLUEB2
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:27 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terragen looks too photo-real.

Bryce 3d was used,
and it creates wonderful fantasy looking terrains,
which is perfect for a fantasy game.

Blender is an OK free 3d program...
but lightwave 3d was used for the modeling,
a far superior program.
Lightwave 3d is used in movies.

Lightwave 3d was used in "300"
and "Titanic" to name a few.

Based you your expressed opinion,
it seems perhaps you have had some experience in 3d graphics.

You need to consider the previous released games,
and then you can see the need for a fantasy looking environment.
versus an "Architectural Looking" render.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:17 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I don't want to offend the artist, but the 3D graphics look amateurish. In my opinion, the art itself could lead to some trouble with sales.


Although i am a sucker for this game (aren't we all Twisted Evil) I kind of agree with this point.

I have harrased (is that the correct spelling) my local shop keeper with the merchandise often enough and the frostwing and firewalker boxes they have the correct look.

After showing the starters he was very sceptic. the box doesn't sell itself. and I think neither will this one. the dice have to be demonstrated. Any possible impulse buyers would go for something else.

Don't get us wrong we do not want to put your good work down. actually it is quite the opposite we want your good work to be sold everywhere around the globe in local game caves so we can do proud battle.

but then gamestores should be enthusiastic about the product (not really the problem) and the look and feel of the box.

this is my opinion and my opinion only i am not trying to tell anyone what to do.
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karoath
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:04 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please don't feel that I am criticizing the artwork itself... it definitely has its place, but just doesn't feel right to me for Dragon Diceā„¢. I would think that Dragon Diceā„¢ (based on older box art) should have less of a cartoon look. These images just don't look like they fit the usual Dragon Diceā„¢ world and atmosphere.

I agree that the terrain should feel like fantasy. This just looks too much like a cartoon world and one that is intended to look like it was rendered in 3D (the dice also look rendered). The lighting and textures are strange and you can easily see unnatural angles. For the Dragon Diceā„¢ setting, I'd think that you'd want a customer to be unaware that the artwork was rendered in 3D... or at least try not to draw attention to the fact. Rendering in 3D certainly is a great tool, but can often feel artificial if not done just right.

Lightwave and Bryce are indeed excellent programs... as are Blender and Terragen, but I don't think any are superior to the others. They each have their place for specific projects. I wasn't intending to lecture on the pros and cons of 3D programs (even though I've used them, I am not a professional 3D modeler). I only wanted to make some suggestions in case this artwork was done rapidly with sub-par software. Please note that I don't consider Blender to be sub-par software. I am an strictly an amateur with 3D modeling, but was able to create the following image in Blender (I think it looks semi-realistic, but still feels like fantasy):
Darkwood
Also, look at these old images that I made many years ago with Terragen to represent the Dragon Diceā„¢ Terrains:
Coastland
Flatland
Highland
Swampland

I just hope you reconsider the style of the artwork as I feel that it could hurt sales. I'll certainly be buying plenty of these for myself, but I have been playing since the TSR days. As such, I am not affected by the box art. However, I often think about how cover/box art can influence me to buy something that I may have been on the fence about. I want SFR to succeed and to continue producing great products. That is my only motivation for friendly criticism.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:05 am GMT    Post subject: Re: New Product for Gencon2010 Reply with quote

cliffwiggs wrote:
New special frontier terrains - the Dragon Lair, Grove, Castle, and Vortex - add a new layer of strategy to your battlefield choices at the start of a game.


Shocked Shocked Shocked

My mind is officially way past blown.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:54 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really can't wait to get my hands on this new terrain expansion! Wink
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cliffwiggs
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:30 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

karoath wrote:

I just hope you reconsider the style of the artwork as I feel that it could hurt sales.
I can understand that, 'you can't judge a book by its cover', but people do.

so good news, bad news...

The bad news (from your POV), this design was sent to the printers a while back and its much too late to change it now. However, we will keep in mind for the next product to release some preview info before its is sent to the printers.

The good news is that this is an expansion, so its not expected to attract new players. By the time you would want to buy this expansion you should already be hooked on the game and understand that the box means nothing to the dice inside.

Its like people who wont buy a kicker because the box has a crushed corner. Are they really going to keep that box forever? no, they are gonna rip it open and throw it away. Its whats inside the box thats important. (Thats my personal opinon) The starter is the hook and impulse buy and where people start.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:48 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

well on to the really important stuff!

Gencon is oktober when will this expansion be available to the general not gencon attending public like us guys from across the pond?
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cliffwiggs
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:01 am GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

dutchjohn wrote:

Gencon is oktober when will this expansion be available to the general not gencon attending public like us guys from across the pond?


Twisted Evil its only February, be patient. The delivery on the 'slow boat' is always a variable, so we will make those decisions and announcements when we get closer to knowing a real date.
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