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Attack and action

 
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Autpost
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:44 am GMT    Post subject: Attack and action Reply with quote

During translation some questions come up about the definition of "action" and "attack".

Quote:
Smite SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, immediately inflict four points of damage on the defending army or unit; no saves (including those provided by spells) can stop this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Smite generates four melee results.

Counter SAI Resolution Type: Normal (melee, save and dragon attack); Special (save against melee)
During a melee attack, Counter generates four melee results. During a save roll, Counter generates four save results. During a save roll in a melee attack, Counter immediately generates both four save and four melee results upon the attacking army or unit. Only magical saves protect against this damage. During a dragon attack, Counter generates four save and four melee results.

Why is there "or unit" written in the descriptions of Smite, Counter and Stone? Is it somehow possible that Smite/Counter inflict damage (individually) to a unit instead of an army, or is "unit" just meant in the way "a one unit army" (which is an army rather than a unit, but for a beginner it would be more clear if "or unit" is added)?

I've thought about Coil/Hug, but in the glossary it says that attack is used only for an army. So Coil/Hug is not a melee attack but something else (the resolution of a SAI). Is this true?
Glossary wrote:
Melee Attack – The acting army rolling for melee results during the attack or counter-attack phase of a
melee action or during a melee avoidance roll. See action.

However Hug uses attack too, in this case it's a unit which attacks:
Quote:
Hug SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, choose one unit in the defending army. Hug immediately inflicts four points of damage on the target unit. The unit gets no saves, but does roll to counter-attack the hugging unit, which cannot save against this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Hug generates four melee results.

In the case of Coil the term attack is not used:
Quote:
Coil SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, choose one unit in the defending army. Coil immediately inflicts four points of damage to the target unit. The target unit makes a combination roll: to generate saves against the Coil damage and/or inflict melee damage on the coiling unit. The coiling unit cannot roll to save against this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Coil generates four melee results.

Just to be sure: Has Counter an effect if it comes up against Coil or Hug?
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chuckpint
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 10:15 am GMT    Post subject: Re: Attack and action Reply with quote

Autpost wrote:
During translation some questions come up about the definition of "action" and "attack".

Quote:
Smite SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, immediately inflict four points of damage on the defending army or unit; no saves (including those provided by spells) can stop this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Smite generates four melee results.

Counter SAI Resolution Type: Normal (melee, save and dragon attack); Special (save against melee)
During a melee attack, Counter generates four melee results. During a save roll, Counter generates four save results. During a save roll in a melee attack, Counter immediately generates both four save and four melee results upon the attacking army or unit. Only magical saves protect against this damage. During a dragon attack, Counter generates four save and four melee results.

Why is there "or unit" written in the descriptions of Smite, Counter and Stone? Is it somehow possible that Smite/Counter inflict damage (individually) to a unit instead of an army, or is "unit" just meant in the way "a one unit army" (which is an army rather than a unit, but for a beginner it would be more clear if "or unit" is added)?


During a Coil/Hug attack, the unit being attacked has a chance to roll a Smite or Counter. By adding "or unit", the Smite or Counter SAI would work during that unit counter-attack.

Autpost wrote:
I've thought about Coil/Hug, but in the glossary it says that attack is used only for an army. So Coil/Hug is not a melee attack but something else (the resolution of a SAI). Is this true?
Glossary wrote:
Melee Attack – The acting army rolling for melee results during the attack or counter-attack phase of a
melee action or during a melee avoidance roll. See action.

However Hug uses attack too, in this case it's a unit which attacks:
Quote:
Hug SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, choose one unit in the defending army. Hug immediately inflicts four points of damage on the target unit. The unit gets no saves, but does roll to counter-attack the hugging unit, which cannot save against this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Hug generates four melee results.


Coil/Hug only works during an melee attack on an army. If rolled against a unit that is Coiling/Hugging this unit, it does not work. That's why the "or unit" is there for Smite (it works in any situation that is a unit melee), but not Hug (it does not work in a situation that is a unit melee).

Autpost wrote:
In the case of Coil the term attack is not used:
Quote:
Coil SAI Resolution Type: Special (melee); Normal (dragon attack or melee avoidance roll)
During a melee attack, choose one unit in the defending army. Coil immediately inflicts four points of damage to the target unit. The target unit makes a combination roll: to generate saves against the Coil damage and/or inflict melee damage on the coiling unit. The coiling unit cannot roll to save against this damage. During a dragon attack or melee avoidance roll, Coil generates four melee results.

Just to be sure: Has Counter an effect if it comes up against Coil or Hug?

Yes a Counter has an affect during a Coil or Hug. In the case of a Hug (which allows no saves), it's simply points of damage against the Hugging unit. In the case of a Coil, it gives you both saves and melee damage. If Counter is rolled against a Hug, both units are killed. If Counter is rolled against a Coil, the Coiling unit is killed, but the Coiled unit saves.

The difference between a Melee attack and action is simple: Action is the entire thing, attack and counter-attack. Melee attack is just part of it. The Marching army decides to take a Melee action does a Melee attack, the defending army saves. Then the roles reverse and the Acting army (former defending army) does a Melee attack (also called a counter-attack), while the Marching army defends. Is that clearer?
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Autpost
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Joined: 18 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:06 pm GMT    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the answer. I'm now proofreading the rules translation, probably a bit too carefully.
Instead of checking every little detail I should rather come to an end.
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