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piMaster
rare
Stockholder
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3235
Location: Rockford, IL
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 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:46 pm GMT Post subject: |
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| cliffwiggs wrote: | | I do. It's a love/hate relationship, but it keeps me consistent. Today it's mostly a hate relationship... |
 Sorry, didn't mean to put a damper on your day. Have a hug.
In the last post on page one of this thread, Cliff wrote that the word ability is in there because it would be "cleaner".
In any event, it seems the rules answered at least some of my question.
| starter rules wrote: | | A daemon loses a battle when its player cannot roll at least one body part or it suffers damage to its last body part during its turn. |
So, that takes care of the situation where Rot lost its last body part from a Fester's back-at-you damage. If the last body part(s) are being grabbed, then the turn sequence would just have to play out and Rot would (probably) lose at the start of its next turn.
Would that be resolution enough?
<edit>
During the suffer damage step, it says that if all your body parts are stunned/wounded/grabbed then you lose immediately. This could be extrapolated to mean mean that at any time all your body parts are st/wd/gb you immediately lose. |
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piMaster
rare
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Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3235
Location: Rockford, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:52 pm GMT Post subject: |
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Comment on Fire:
It seems to me that its timing is different than what you would instinctively think it would be. Based on its wording (similar to mouth and brain) and the complications involved in trying to use it during the suffer damage step (because how do you know if the damage came from a body part or item? only brain-guided attacks can be certain), I have come to believe that fire should be implemented before the suffer damage step.
So, that part of the turn sequence becomes:
. . .
Array Defenses
Mouth Recoveries
Stingers injecting poison goto stun pool
Fire ability (converts one stun into a wound)
Choose targets for brain-guided attacks
Suffer stuns and wounds
Frost ability
Fester ability
Blood ability
Choose next player
. . .
Do that look reasonable? |
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chuckpint
White Dragon
SFR President
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 9187
Location: Evanston, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:07 pm GMT Post subject: |
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| piMaster wrote: | | (because how do you know if the damage came from a body part or item? only brain-guided attacks can be certain) |
It doesn't matter which die did the stun, exactly. The point is (assuming a 13-dice battle), as a Fire Daemon, you get to convert one stun from a body part into a wound. So if all your stuns are from items (or no stuns at all), then you don't get to change a stun to a wound. That's really what's important.
_________________
You can never have too many dice.
First Place at the first ever Daemon Dice sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Dice, 20,000 Daemon Dice, and others (too many to count). |
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piMaster
rare
Stockholder
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3235
Location: Rockford, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:12 pm GMT Post subject: |
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| Wait, so does that mean that the attacker (i.e. the fire daemon) chooses which stun becomes a wound? Since the rules don't specify I assumed that the defender chooses which stun gets converted to a wound. |
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chuckpint
White Dragon
SFR President
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 9187
Location: Evanston, IL
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| Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 2:50 pm GMT Post subject: |
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I don't know how you read my statement as saying that a Fire Daemon gets to choose which die to wound. All the Fire Daemon gets to do is to say that one stun becomes a wound. So the defender gets to pick which dice are stunned, and then pick one of those to be wounded.
_________________
You can never have too many dice.
First Place at the first ever Daemon Dice sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Dice, 20,000 Daemon Dice, and others (too many to count). |
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piMaster
rare
Stockholder
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3235
Location: Rockford, IL
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| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:09 pm GMT Post subject: |
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| chuckpint wrote: | | I don't know how you read my statement as saying that a Fire Daemon gets to choose which die to wound. |
Well lets see, you said "as a Fire Daemon, you get to convert one stun from a body part into a wound". How else is someone supposed to read that? Moving on...
| Chuck Pint wrote: | | All the Fire Daemon gets to do is to say that one stun becomes a wound. So the defender gets to pick which dice are stunned, and then pick one of those to be wounded. |
You're still missing the point I'm making.
Anyway, I solved the problem I was having my changing my damage accounting system. The system you're using is "Do the math first, then pick out the appropriate number of dice". That works most of the time, but there is one instance where it does not: a fire daemon with an item. This is because of the very specific requirements of the fire daemon's ability.
Here is an example: I (a frost daemon) get hit by a fire arm and a brain-guided axe. The axe targets my shell. If we use the "do the math" system, then you would calculate that I would take one stun and one wound (1 stun from arm and 1 wound from axe, frost ability changes axe wound to a stun, then fire ability changes one of my stuns into a wound). By your system, it wouldn't matter which die I took for the stun and which I took for the wound. But in this case that doesn't work. Frost ability allows me to change the shell's damage into a stun, but I cannot apply fire's effect to the shell because the shell wasn't damaged by a fire body part.
I'm now using the "target the damage as you take it" system. I put the damage taken next to the attacks that caused the damage. If the attack is brain-guided then the attacker chooses the targets, otherwise the defender chooses the targets. Then accounting for the fire ability is quite simple and straightforward. |
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cliffwiggs
SFR Treasurer
Chief Wheedler
SDA - Rules NitPicker
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 10794
Location: Cumming, GA - USA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:18 pm GMT Post subject: |
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Pi,
I see what you are saying from a programming POV and think you are now doing it as you would in a real game with dice in front of you on a table.
They defend your arrayed attacks. If there are fire body parts, you just remind them that one of those is a wound.
If there is any reason to specify what damage is taken for each attack, then it is easy enough to do in person. A bit harder to do via a mouse.
and you know I'm going to completely change the items, so I advise you skip that part for now.
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Multiplayer Champion Gencon11/Battlefest Champion(tied) GenCon10/World Champion GenCon07/National Champion Origins05/Intermediate Champion GenCon02/Novice Champion Origins99 |
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piMaster
rare
Stockholder
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3235
Location: Rockford, IL
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| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:49 pm GMT Post subject: |
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| cliffwiggs wrote: | | and you know I'm going to completely change the items, so I advise you skip that part for now. |
Other than your cryptic whispers of "I want to change them" I haven't seen anything else on that front. I like them fairly well as they currently are. Besides, are they really going to be completely, totally changed beyond all recognition?
So I'll just keep on keepin' on.  |
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cliffwiggs
SFR Treasurer
Chief Wheedler
SDA - Rules NitPicker
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 10794
Location: Cumming, GA - USA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 7:56 pm GMT Post subject: |
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They could possibly be changed completely...
*whispers in the dark*
*skitter under the sofa*
_________________
Multiplayer Champion Gencon11/Battlefest Champion(tied) GenCon10/World Champion GenCon07/National Champion Origins05/Intermediate Champion GenCon02/Novice Champion Origins99 |
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