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chrisbogert · Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 9:04 am GMT Post subject: Sneak Attack SAI question

I was wondering about the sneak attack SAI.
So if I roll sneak attack during a missile or magic action with the Dragonlord, four units in the target army are killed with no save?
Seems really strong.. is that right?
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cliffwiggs · Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 9:24 am GMT Post subject:

two changes to what you said.

It is 4 health and it is an opposing army (which means at the same terrain as the dragon lord).

It doesn't work during any save or avoidance roll. It is only a missile action and a magic action.

It can be powerful, but isn't unbeatable.

It used to be a lot stronger (I miss those days sometimes)
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stormywaters · rare Joined: 22 May 2011 Posts: 1403

cliffwiggs · Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 1:56 pm GMT Post subject:

what change would you suggest to make it easier? just putting the extra text in every sai which uses the term opposing?
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stormywaters · rare Joined: 22 May 2011 Posts: 1403

chrisbogert · Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 4:45 am GMT Post subject:

I got the opposing part, but it says opposing in any army. So wouldn't that be not just the one at your terrain?

In the rulebook it says "...immediately kill up to 4 health-worth of opposing units in any army..."

The Dragonlord has 4 sneak attack icons on one side. So would that really kill four different units up to four health each?
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chuckpint · Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:42 am GMT Post subject:

chrisbogert · Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:15 am GMT Post subject:

yeah I know it says 4-health worth of units.
So with the Dragonlord having 4 sneak attack icons,
4 health worht of units X4
Seems mighty powerful, so I thought I had it wrong.
I guess I got it right in the first place.
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stormywaters · rare Joined: 22 May 2011 Posts: 1403

stormywaters · rare Joined: 22 May 2011 Posts: 1403

cliffwiggs · Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 1:00 pm GMT Post subject:

chrisbogert · Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:02 pm GMT Post subject:

Ok, I got it. Thank you many times.

I don't think I will forget this rule again.
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danilo · common Joined: 26 Jan 2010 Posts: 490

chrisbogert · Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:37 am GMT Post subject:

Yeah, that is exactly why I got all confused.
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cliffwiggs · Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 9:15 am GMT Post subject:

ah... something to add to a rules rewrite. Thanks for checking that for me.

I understand what was trying to be done when that happened, but ... obviously it didn't work out that way.
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BBrauser · dragonsteed Joined: 25 Aug 2005 Posts: 62

I'm looking at the little paper insert that came with my dragon slayer and I see that the original wording was "it instantly slays 4 health-worth of opposing units in any army at the same terrain, with no saves possible."

The current online manual is just omitting the words "at the same terrain." for those who understand the glossary definition of opposing units this might be redundant. But I've ran into new players who either focus on the ANY ARMY and assume that's any of them at any terrain, OR they think this either any army that opposed their maneuver attempt or who is in battle (being attacked) by the acting army.

Would it simplify to just state "4 health-worth of units in any army at the same terrain."? would there be any reason the word opposing would need to be used in this instance and would not saying it this way fully cover how the SAI is intended to be used?

Side note, I just rebuilt the Sneak Attack icon as a vector file with all four swords arranged as it shows on the die. I could send either that or just update the manual and send, or both if you like
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chuckpint · Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 10:32 am GMT Post subject:

We are going to drop the game term "opposing" it's been the biggest confuser of players in the current rules. So your wording is fine.

We show the icon as it is to show that it's just one. We almost ended up with a die that had 3 not 4 of the Sneak Attack icons. I think we will leave it as is in the rules.
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UltimaGabe · Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 12:25 am GMT Post subject:

I know I'm late to the party, but I just wanted to make sure of one thing... if you have a Dragonlord at your Home terrain and are making a ranged attack against an army at the Frontier terrain, and you roll Sneak Attack, do you kill 4 health-worth of units at the Home terrain, even though you're attacking a different army?

I've never had a unit with Sneak Attack until now so I've never thought about it, that just sounds kind of wonky (though if that was the intent, to differentiate it from Smite, I understand). Just wanted to make sure.

chuckpint · Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:08 am GMT Post subject:

Sneak Attack can and does allow you to attack a different army than the one that your army is attacking. So in your example, yes, the Sneak Attack would be against an army at your Home terrain.

Also note that Sneak Attack has one unique property. If the target of a Sneak Attack chooses Dragonkin as the casualties, then those Dragonkin are buried. It's one of the few ways to bury Dragonkin (which are immune to the normal "kill and bury" of SAIs that do that).
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You can never have too many dice.
First Place at the first ever Daemon Dice sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Dice, 20,000 Daemon Dice, and others (too many to count).