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slcobbs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 10:48 am GMT Post subject: Dispel Magic

Is it me or does dispel magic seem to weak?

What I mean is that it protects the army, terrain, and itself, but it doesn't protect the individuals in its army. The dispel icon is at most 2 per monster, thus only 20% of the time does it get rolled. Shouldn't it extend the protection to its fellow units? What do you all think?

piMaster · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:35 am GMT Post subject:

Sounds good to me.

Related question: If a unit w/Dispel were in the DUA, would it extend its protection to the other units there (or to the DUA itself) as well?

-Brad

riolis · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:40 am GMT Post subject:

I see no reason why dispel should not carry to the indivdual units around it, after all most of the other SAI can work that way
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Majiken · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:52 am GMT Post subject:

slcobbs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 12:09 pm GMT Post subject:

I'm not the rules guru of the bunch, but I think the owl would get to roll.
Magic is targeting the die, its special ability kicks in. The only reason I think this is because the pheonix gets to roll whenever someone tried to bury it. If it rolls the rise from the ashes icon then it is not buried.

Now let the rules lawyers take it.

Scott C

cliffwiggs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:03 pm GMT Post subject:

This is off the cuff. I haven't checked the rulebook (which means Chuck will probably correct me very shortly with an email I sent 3 years ago on this subject Wink

).

First the easy one...

Rise From Ashes works because the SAI sepcifically says 'when buried'. Note: it is not an attempt to bury, but once the bury has actually happened.

Now the next easy because I think it is just an interpretation issue...

I've never seen a dead dispeling unit roll. But people forget to roll Dispel all the time.

Dispel targets 'Unit' 'Army' 'Terrain'.
The dead unit area is not a terrain, however (I don't agree with it, but) according to the glossary the units in the DUA are considered an Army.

So if an effect says 'Target the DUA and bury 4 health' ... The DUA is not an army, unit, or Terrain. So even though the spell is affecting the army in the DUA, the actual target is the DUA, not the army. You could argue the point, but I don't think it would roll.

If an effect says 'Target 4 health in the DUA'... I think it would apply, but only to the portion of the effect that targeted the Unit (per the SAI description). So the Unicorn could keep itself dead, but not prevent the common next to it from being buried.

Finally, the original post. Which is really requesting a change to the SAI description. 'extend Dispel protection to any unit in the same army' It would definately make those units more powerful, but would we have another 'medusa' on our hands where everyone included a few in their army? If you put 3-4 monsters (half your army) as dispel-ing units, then you would basically be magic proof. Right now the best way to kill a Dispeling unit is with L.Strike, but if my 4 unicorns all got to roll for a L.Strike cast on one of them, it would almost never get through.

Additionally, it might change the careful wording of the effect of a dispel unit in the DUA. If we worded this wrong, then a single dispelling unit would provide a 20% Burial protection against every unit in the DUA.

How many units even have Dispel? 6? maybe as many as 10? I would have to play test this to death before I endorsed it, but I'm not against it.

chuckpint · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:49 pm GMT Post subject:

slcobbs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:51 pm GMT Post subject:

I don't mind someone using 4 unicorns since that is 16 health of his army. Unicorns are pretty cool, but nothing to be afraid of. Just gives a viable option for an army that does not contain magic.

Scott C

slcobbs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:57 pm GMT Post subject:

I don't see how it unbalances the game. It makes it so Magic isn't always necessary in tournament army. Which I believe is the state of the environment now. It would give possible but not always protection from magic.

Scott C

chuckpint · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:05 pm GMT Post subject:

Scott, I have five full pages of notes on this. We went back and forth about it for months. This is one can of worms we don't want to open again.
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cliffwiggs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:09 pm GMT Post subject:

chuckpint · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:15 pm GMT Post subject:

No, it's only 5, I just didn't list the Unicorn.
_________________
You can never have too many dice.
First Place at the first ever Daemon Dice sealed starter tournament.
Battlefest tied for first GenCon 2012
Single Race Champion GenCon 2008-2009, Sealed Box Champion GenCon 2007,2009,
My collection is 21,500 Dragon Dice, 20,000 Daemon Dice, and others (too many to count).

cliffwiggs · Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:20 pm GMT Post subject:

hee-hee. SOMEDAY it'll be 6. Then I will be retroactively correct Laughing

fingreen · Newbie Joined: 27 May 2005 Posts: 1

They can simply make that only one dispel can active against each spell. And allow people to roll dispel when ever people cast spell on your army,other units and terrain you have units in.